Why does this have to happen?

I’ve been gaming since I was maybe 5 or 6. I learned to read because I was driven to play video games like my big brother. He taught me how to read the captions and menu and then I started playing Shining Force. Memories. To me, games are just that. They are meant to be entertaining. They are meant to be enjoyed so that you can reflect back on them and think “I really loved that game. Maybe when the summer rolls around I’ll start playing it again!” But maybe that’s just me. Maybe my experiences with games are different. Maybe it’s because I’m the only girl in my family and because of that video games, and roll playing games, and hell even sports were introduced to me at a very young age. I was accepted into these habits by my brothers and cousins who encouraged me to try them. This is why when I started playing online games, which is only something I began about a year ago, I couldn’t understand the online social climate.

When I was playing Left For Dead 2 with a group of random strangers a few months ago out of boredom, our group consisted of three women and only one man (ironically he was playing Rochelle). The guy was so shocked that there were so many women playing L4D2 but he didn’t mind. He was thrilled actually because he said now he could prove that women DO play games to his older sister. However, after that first game the girls and I decided to stick in the lobby and wait for another person. Another man came in and when we started playing he realized we were all women and started criticizing us for being “bad shots” and not being able to “keep up to his level”. Now, I was so outraged by this (I did tell him he should move out of his mother’s basement) because it was my first encounter with a male gamer being critical of a woman just because she is well... Enjoying the same thing as him. I shot my mouth off a bit but he never once called me an ugly cow and I didn't end up having to remind him that his penis was only two inches.

Then I came across this site: http://fatuglyorslutty.com/
This site is about women who get harassed by men while they are gaming. I’ve noticed that most of this is on xbox which further proves that men who play xbox are small-dicked degenerates (Sorry I had an ex who was crazy for Halo so now I’m bitter).

But seriously, why does this have to happen? Since most of the posters here are smart men, I thought I’d bring this question to the table. Why do these men have to threaten and harass these women when all they are doing is enjoying the same recreation that they enjoy? Why is there sexism in the online gaming world?

A more valid question might be "Why is there sexism, period?"

In the case of an online context, it's easy to cower behind the aegis of anonymity, free from fears of any kind of retribution (at least until my patent for a device to send a power surge through coaxial cable lines comes to fruition...).

Part of the online issue also stems from the fact that so many of the harder-core gamers (not all, but many) tend to be introverted shut-ins with poor interpersonal skills. However, when dealing with people online, it's not as though they're dealing with "real people," so the usual blocks that interject themselves when talking to people don't come into play. They run a stream-of-consciousness from their mind to their mouth, without any sort of filtering.

Part of it stems from a primitive, lizard-brained NEED to be seen as some sort of Alpha by women (which is what provokes the standard "r u a grl?" response as soon as they hear your voice is not what they expect to hear). They think that by showing themselves to be "cocky" or "confident," they gain points. When they're inevitably shot down, they retort with sour grapes.

If that sounds a little far-fetched, try looking up typical Guido bar behavior, and you'll notice some similarities. This sort of behavior isn't unknown in meatspace, either.

Honestly, I've been around sexism in various forms in my two major career choices. As a Marine, it occurred in my first MOS (Artillery) because the general consensus was that most women would not be capable of the physical exertions necessary to emplace and operate the howitzer. I stayed out of those discussions, because I'm a proponent of allowing anyone who can meet the minimum physical standards into the MOS of their choice.

In the police world, sexism is not nearly as blatant, but tends towards the more insidious. A lot of the time, senior staff members who are women are viewed with a certain level of distrust ("She HAD to have slept her way to those stripes," etc), while junior officers are either objects of scorn or lust - or both. Rare is the officer who can view his female counterparts as strict equals in this field.


All in all, it sounds as though Skippy the Wonderfuck needed some schoolin', you supplied it. Brava, signorina, brava.

Hey, I happen to be offended by your stereotyping of Xbox players LOL... OK, But seriously...

But yeah, sexism is far from uncommon in online gaming, as is racism and homophobia. There's always a subset of people who think that, because that are anonymous, they should go ahead and spout racial and sexual slurs.

Personally, I just ignore these people, but Xbox Live actually does have a feature where you can "mute" a player if your sick of their crap. I would assume other consoles and PCs have a similar feature. Kinda hard to do with a 4-player co-op game like Left 4 Dead, though, it's more intended for larger-party multiplayer games like Halo.

Unfortunately, online gaming is just full of dickheads. Its worse on consoles in my experience too.

Just get used to the fact that everyone already thinks they are better than you not because you are a girl, but because they get some feeling of superiority from video games. There is always some reason things went badly other than "I did bad."

You're playing a team game too...player versus player almost always end in a blame-fest.

Sorry to read you have been treated badly. Maybe hopefully, these people will grow up one day and regret their comments. People are a work in progress, and clearly these guys need more work.

Somewhat related, posted on another forum I frequent:

Personally, I like playing games with women online. Being introverted myself, it's an opportunity to reach out anonymously and chat without the risk of getting slapped that I'm used to (j/k, never been slapped).

I believe women are better at a lot of things than men. Holding grudges and being emotionally unstable being primary among them ( ), but also "manly" things like sports, games, and even firearms. Many a man has found himself out-shot by a woman he taught the basics to.
I don't hold sexism in any high regard. Women are capable, and if they are up to the task and desire to do so, then why not let them?
"-isms" of any type come down to simply getting over your own perception of things and learning to use it the way you use any other natural law. Gravity is there, get over it and drop a water balloon.

I agree with you completely Maverick except I ussually got hit with a rowing oar not fun

You know at the convention I attend, I have been treated the same way in the game room of all things. Finally I did say something, the convention director of the room who is a guy said he was pissed that his girlfriend and I were treated like we were interloping into something that some guys believed they were the only ones to play.

how it started, well...it was really petty, i was playing a fighting game, no idea what one it was, but I was owning this one guy. He started making a huge fuss about how it wasn't suitable for me, a girl to be playing, what he called in the male's club. I didn't know there was a club at my convention that I wasn't allowed to be in....news to me

I've never tried the online gaming thing myself but it seems by what you describe to be a side-effect of the anonymity granted by the internet. I trust that none of these fools would have the nerve to say these things to your face, in real life but hidden behind a screen name an "anything goes" attitude prevails.

Many women online simply chose an androgynous screen name to hide their gender but I'm not sure this is the best long term solution...it only serves to re-enforce the illusion that there are "no girls on the internet" and further isolates those who are up-front about their gender. Being that I am male I have no right to tell anyone which is the correct option for them.

That said; it sounds as if you stood up for yourself just fine, Cherubino. The worst thing you can do is stop doing what you love just because of a couple of assholes.

Honestly, I'm not that surprised. People can be pretty despicable at times, and there are very few who can actually empathise with others.
I tend to find that those few are the only ones who do nothing like this - be it sexism, racism, or even just prejudging people based on what others have said. It's human nature, and frankly, human nature is not an advantage to us anymore.

First of all, I thank you all for taking the time to read and comment!

Second of all, look what I found!
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/halo-eric-nylund/1004880257
Wow look at that! A Halo novel. And here I thought people who played Halo didn't know how to read. Hahaha ok ok now I'm getting mean.

Part of the online issue also stems from the fact that so many of the harder-core gamers (not all, but many) tend to be introverted shut-ins with poor interpersonal skills. However, when dealing with people online, it's not as though they're dealing with "real people," so the usual blocks that interject themselves when talking to people don't come into play. They run a stream-of-consciousness from their mind to their mouth, without any sort of filtering.

I see... So it's like projection. Even still, that's not a good enough excuse. BTW I liked the movie it was very well thought out. Thanks!

Personally, I just ignore these people, but Xbox Live actually does have a feature where you can "mute" a player if your sick of their crap. I would assume other consoles and PCs have a similar feature. Kinda hard to do with a 4-player co-op game like Left 4 Dead, though, it's more intended for larger-party multiplayer games like Halo.

I wish they had it for steam. Block that chat too. I dunno if I ever encounter another person like that I'm gonna rip them a new asshole and then shove sharp objects up the new asshole I just created.

Personally, I like playing games with women online. Being introverted myself, it's an opportunity to reach out anonymously and chat without the risk of getting slapped that I'm used to (j/k, never been slapped).

You totally DO get slapped lol!

I agree with you completely Maverick except I ussually got hit with a rowing oar not fun

Well that sounds kinky. I think you should enjoy it.

how it started, well...it was really petty, i was playing a fighting game, no idea what one it was, but I was owning this one guy. He started making a huge fuss about how it wasn't suitable for me, a girl to be playing, what he called in the male's club. I didn't know there was a club at my convention that I wasn't allowed to be in....news to me

That's so crazy... Was this in America? No it had to be. Only American's are that stupid to act as though women shouldn't be playing a game cuz it isn't girly enough. So were those dudes reprimanded? What was done at the convention to further ensure that no other women would be discriminated or harassed?

Many women online simply chose an androgynous screen name to hide their gender but I'm not sure this is the best long term solution...it only serves to re-enforce the illusion that there are "no girls on the internet" and further isolates those who are up-front about their gender.

Geez then what do people think my gender is when they read my name? I tend to use Cherubino lol! If anyone know's who Cherubino was then they'll know the character itself is a gender bending character lol! Maybe that's why dudes are nasty to me online lol.

I tend to find that those few are the only ones who do nothing like this - be it sexism, racism, or even just prejudging people based on what others have said. It's human nature, and frankly, human nature is not an advantage to us anymore.

Aww Tito! You sound so down on the human race right now lol

Wow look at that! A Halo novel. And here I thought people who played
Halo didn't know how to read. Hahaha ok ok now I'm getting mean.

They can read. It just doesn't go very far beyond the buttons on the gamepad. PC gamers are by far the more intelligent of the species.

maverick375 wrote:They can read. It just doesn't go very far beyond the buttons on the gamepad. PC gamers are by far the more intelligent of the species.

This made me laugh. Maybe because I'm part of the PC master race

As an avid gamer myself, I'd say that the majority of gamers are, unfortunately, raging morons. We're definitely in a minority for being at all decent or civil. If you're going to try and keep your sanity as a gamer, you should try:

A) Lowering your expectations of gamers
B) Playing more single player games
C) Mute every single person you come across before they start talking

I personally find B to work best, but I employ all of these. It makes gaming a lot less stressful, much more enjoyable, and you'll probably live longer.

Because of the under the guise of "anonymity" people act like assholes online. They can act like a dick to a total stranger thinking they can't do anything even if they trash talk all the time.

The way you talk to someone in their face is completely different than when you can't see them.

Online gaming consists of idiots who have nothing to do but play 24/7 so they have something to prove to themselves because they have nothing to prove about themselves to the real world. They are the ones who give LAME and LOOSER its meaning.

Another thing you have to worry about is the results of an online survey back in 1998- 90% of all online female identities are actually males looking for (the wrong type of) attention. This still holds true today though the percentage is lower as far as the internet is concerned but higher on online gaming communities.

You'd think you have problems? Seriously, compared to them, your problems are insignificant to theirs. They stay onliine, dont work, live in their parent's house even though they are past their mid 20s and some into their 40s. Most dont bathe as they play on hours and hours and hours on end. They think they are the gods of the digital universe. Ha! Cheri... you have talent, you have skills. You have done things that most of us would never have. I used to program games, you dont want to hear what I have to say about online games. If anything, they are good for a couple of hours of entertainment and thats it. Anything past that is a waste of life. Proof is right there by what you stated. Now thing, if that is what they have to say about others, what do you think they look like themselves? Worse by a few factors. That I can guarantee!

Cheri- dont let this bother you. They are just fools. Dont put yourself to their level. They cant compete on yours.

Whatface wrote:

maverick375 wrote:They can read. It just doesn't go very far beyond the buttons on the gamepad. PC gamers are by far the more intelligent of the species.

This made me laugh. Maybe because I'm part of the PC master race

I used to be a much more avid PC gamer, especially when I played MMOs a lot, and I would like to mod, too....unfortunately my PC is a bit outdated for gaming, and apparantly the most advanced games I can play on here is Half-Life 1 GoldSrc, Halo 1 PC, and older Battlefield games. Anything more recent freezes. I even got The Orange Box for Xbox instead of PC. The fact my computer has accumulated a LOT of information to store is also a probable factor....that reminds me. Gotta go clean this thing out.
This was one of the causes for a personal shift towards consoles that has lasted until...well, about right now.

Ironically, I got this PC from a guy that was a major PC gamer, and was filled with, well, a LOT of games. I had to uninstall a lot of them for better computer performance.
Of course, its nearly ten years old, and I got it about...eight years ago? Technology marches on .

Still love PCs, though. I just got a newer one .

Anyway, back to the point of the topic. I tend to be able to ignore any people that are greatly annoying, and I think I actually didn't even notice the presence of one quite often. That might be because I rarely use mics online, and always have the volume rather low. Well, that's an idea.

ElfenMagix wrote:Online gaming consists of idiots who have nothing to do but play 24/7 so they have something to prove to themselves because they have nothing to prove about themselves to the real world. They are the ones who give LAME and LOOSER its meaning.

.............ouch..............

Cherubino wrote:

I tend to find that those few are the only ones who do nothing like this - be it sexism, racism, or even just prejudging people based on what others have said. It's human nature, and frankly, human nature is not an advantage to us anymore.

Aww Tito! You sound so down on the human race right now lol

Harsh! :p
But yeah, this is why I don't listen to the news >_<
Inevitably, I just end up hating the majority of humanity. With good reason. People suck.

That's why I only ever play singleplayer games, unless I know the people I'm playing IRL *shrug*

This happened to me and Trisha when we were playing vs. mode in Left 4 Dead 2. A guy came on and started cursing at how "bad" we played. Online gaming is full of trolls and it's usually the girls who get picked on because guys "know more" about gaming. *rolls eyes*

It used to bother me when guys would get angry at me for no reason. Now it doesn't get to me. They're the losers who have nothing better to do with they're lives. :3

Nuke is Good wrote:Because of the under the guise of "anonymity" people act like assholes online. They can act like a dick to a total stranger thinking they can't do anything even if they trash talk all the time.

The way you talk to someone in their face is completely different than when you can't see them.

Courtesy of Penny Arcade:

Elfen, thank you for such kind words! I wish everyone had the same ideas as you guys here. You're all so generous and accepting.

To be honest I don't even play random games often. I play them very rarely but when I do I tend to get shit...

Triela, you shoulda taken down names and addresses cuz I would have slapped those guys so silly their mothers vagina's would quake.

LOL Godot I love that picture!!!!

Ahaha!! Thanks! XD I know you would have killed him if you were in that game! XD

It's odd that they would be saying stuff to you anyway, Cheru. You play on normal, hence you're still learning. I get mad when there's a new person playing on advanced or expert who doesn't know how to play and gets us all killed. XD Of corse I don't curse him/her out for it. :3

Triela wrote:Ahaha!! Thanks! XD I know you would have killed him if you were in that game! XD

It's odd that they would be saying stuff to you anyway, Cheru. You play on normal, hence you're still learning. I get mad when there's a new person playing on advanced or expert who doesn't know how to play and gets us all killed. XD Of corse I don't curse him/her out for it. :3

I dunno. Most of the time the people who play easy or normal are either still learning or are people who are really advanced and like to be kinda like teachers. I've encountered some cool people from that. This one girl helped me figure out a short cut in the dark carnival so that was cool.

You should totally curse at them and tell them they're so fat and ugly! That's totally rational

Honestly this just sounds like a typical case of elitism. It probably had nothing to do with the fact that you have a vagina. People like him just get mad at something and look for SOMETHING, ANYTHING they can use to try and make them feel better than you...the most obvious difference between you and him was your gender so he chose that. I'm sure in games with males just as skilled as you 3 are, he would find something else to attack them on.

Well, I tend to rage on games that depend mainly on luck. Games more based on skill I don't sweat about winning or losing because usually the outcome is defined by how well you played or your opponent, if you lost you have to give the point that he played better and it wasn't just a stroke of luck that made he win.

Thus I play a lot of fighting games or solo games competing against other players scores (like Stepmania or Pump it Up) where both players start every match at the same conditions. This also keeps me away from online games that are level based, mainly MMOs where gaking low level players is possible, if having a higher level makes one clearly superior I think it's not fun to be "punished" just because other people have more playtime than you, even if you are more skilled (old skill vs gear, after all gear is also "level").

But do expect me raging or teasing other players while playing mahjong or poker... well, most of "gambling" is all about mood anyways.

NeverSleep wrote:But do expect me raging or teasing other players while playing mahjong or poker... well, most of "gambling" is all about mood anyways.

But also mahjong and poker are games you play face to face and typically involve winning or losing money... Gambling is all in the mind. Not halo. Halo is for people who don't have a brain -.-

Cherubino wrote: Halo is for people who don't have a brain -.-

Ahem,isn't that a bit rude ? i wouldn't want anyone to think you were being rude online !

Awinnell wrote:

Cherubino wrote: Halo is for people who don't have a brain -.-

Ahem,isn't that a bit rude ? i wouldn't want anyone to think you were being rude online !

The irony of it all makes my head want to explode!